Im strongly considering using a points system next year.  Here is how it will work. 

10 Boats

1st place - 11 points 2nd place - 10 points  .......... 10th place 1 point

Seems to be the fairest way to use points in a small club like ours.

Opinions

I like the idea but I have a couple of questions/suggestion:

- What would we do in case of a tie? In my opinion, it won't happen that often for guys weighing in fish but it if does and two guys tie for 2nd, would they both get 9 pts
and the guy right behind them would count as 4th getting 7 pts?
- A minimum of one point should be granted to everyone who shows up.
- Place points should only be given to those who weigh fish. Everyone who gets skunked just gets the show-up point.
- To go along with the new rule of charging anglers who back out at the last minute, we should also consider a point penalty to re-enforce the rule.

Extra clicks. Sorry.

Ross, how do we delete a post on this board?

 I would be 100% on board for a points system. I never understood why clubs in Illinois use weight to determine places. IMO it proves nothing other than a good tourney or two can carry you through. 

Is a tough tourney where 8# wins less of an accomplishment then a bed fishing 20# slug fest?

We should only use a point system, but we should use the "standard" way it is used by organizations/clubs across the nation.

Its really, really straight forward.

There are generally three types of tounaments, Teams, Singles and Draw.

A Team is tracked for point purposes the entire season.  Teams are allowed to have alternates, however, there are penalties involved when an alternate is used. (if you want to know more I can tell ya about it).

A Single is a one vs. one, where each person is tracked individually, IOW, high-side vs high-side only.

A Draw (what we do) is where there is a high-side and low-side.  Each side is tracked within its grouping for AOY points.

Points in each of these situations are determined before a season starts generally based on the number of boats.  So for example, if a tournament trail has 200 boats, they will use a 200+ point system.  If you have 15 boats, it is a 15+ point system . This provides the fairest system for those that miss events.

TournyJett uses a Total Event Allocation Points and Total Participant Points method which we decided upon after reviewing a gazzillion different models.  Total Event Allocation would be like the 200+ points above.  Total Particiation Points would be like 10-25% for those that participate that do not weigh in.

The IBF uses 100 Total Event Allocation Points with 25 Total Participant Points.  The only way you don't get points is (a) don't show up (b) get DQ'd or (c) you are so late to weigh in that you have no weight left.

There is no tournament organization that we reviewed that drives points in reverse order, TourneyJett will not do that either because we have yet another ranking beyond the organization/club known as the TourneyJett Power Ranking.  This is an aggregate across all different tournament types.  (Tony can discuss this more).

I suggest that we follow the standard and consistent methods of point management.

Ross

Oh yes, and why they may only do points in total accumlated order may be an issue of motivation and physchology.  You very rarely want a bank account with 0 dollars in it, he who has the most dollars in it is most generally the happier of the two...  

Just a WAG as to why it is the way it is.

 Good input but there's no need to complicate it. Any number for points is fine as long as its consistent. Just use 25 and call it good. We'll never have that many so there's plenty cusion.  I dont agree with participation points though. I think it should be a zero unless you weigh a fish. 

walt,

You are a seasoned angler, you have seen a lot, but... ok, I agree, if you don't want participation points (which on TJ isn't complicated to use), fine, then say you use 100 pts, anyone that doesn't weigh gets squat.  So, anyone new to the club says, WTF, I showed up, I don't get anything?  Hell I get 25 for IBF or BFL just to show! That's how its done friend.  but let's use your scenario...

Ben
Ross
Kyle
Tom
Erric
Tony
Walt
Clint

We all show up, Ben, Tom and Ross zeros, no pts, Kyle and Eric tie, but Kyle has big fish, Tony has 4 lbs and you win with 6.15. So, You get 100, Tony gets 99, Kyle get 98, Eric 97, Ben,Tom and Ross get 25 pts.  Clint can't make it, 0 pts.

So who leads?

Walt=100
Tony=99
Kyle 98
Eric=97
Ben, Tom and Ross=25
Clint=0

This week, you win, next week, who knows?

It all depends.

There is nothing complicated about it.  This is how TJ works and we are using TJ to calculate the totals.

So let's continue

Next event.

Wal= 0
Kyle=0
Eric=0
Tony, Ben, Tom and Ross 99, 98, 97 and 96 respectively
Clint 100

who is leading now?

Walt 100+0 =100
Kyle 99+0 = 99
Eric = 98 + 0 = 98
Tony 99 + 99 = 198
Ben 25+98 = 123
Tom 97 + 25 = 122
Ross 96 + 25 = 121
Clint =100 +0 = 100

Tony is winning. If I did the math right.

In 1 tournament, everything has changed.  This is fair.  Your most recent event gives you the advantage and gives you motivation to continue.

At the end... he with the most points wins.  Simple, effective and on target.

Now look at Clint, he fished two events (and weighed in 1) and still gets 100 points because he won!  He is sitting in tied for 4th with you because, he showed up.  That's how the big boys do it, we should do it the same way too (IMNSHO).

Ross

Seems like we are all on the same page. Ben can set up a system with a 10 base and 2 in participation. 10 points will go to the winner, 9 to 2nd and on down. If you zero, you get 2 points for showing up. Every organization we researched gives you a minimum amount of points for showing up. We have never had more than 8 boats for a club event, so 10 will be fine. If we have a run on participation between now and our first event, then we can increase the number system. The only thing that matters is that it is consistent. The AOY for both low and high will be figured individually. The AOY winner at the end of the year will have the most points . This is already built and super easy to implement. it will be automated and fair. We've been studying this stuff for a year, so I promise all of ya that this is the most fair way to judge consistency over time.

I tried an experiment just to see how this system would have worked using the old Standings which are currently found on this website. I only examined the weights found on the high side and applied points for each tournament as Ben originally suggested with 11 going to first place, 10 to second, etc. I assumed all anglers were present at every tournament and no fish = no points. The results for AOY would have remained the same, but there were some flips. Here is how it breaks down:

In terms of weight, ranking first to last place:

Ben 40.14
Tony 35.12
Clint 26.5
Tom 23.15
Ross 22.13
John 22.4
Rob 21.4
Kyle 16.3
Phil 9.13

In terms of points:

Ben 44
Tony 36
Clint 32
Tom 31
Rob 26
Ross 24
Kyle and John Tied for 21
Phil 10

Rob and Ross seem to be the ones who were most impacted by this system as Rob caught less fish weight than Ross but ended up ranking higher. Both Rob and Ross had two zeros, meaning their total consisted of how well they did in only three tournaments. Rob got 9-8-9 in points while Ross got 7-10-7. Despite the fact Ross actually caught more in total weight of fish (about 1.5 pounds difference), Rob ranked slightly better at more tournaments. It appears the point system would have been more fair in this respect.

John would also have been impacted as he dropped one placement ranking when the point system was applied. Like Ross and Rob, he had two zeros with 4-7-10 in points. He caught 7 ounces less than Ross in fish weight but one pound more than Rob in fish weight, yet he ranked lower than both during the tournaments. The point system places both Rob and Ross ahead of John, which does appear to be fair.

Sorry about BFL reference, you are correct on that.

Matt,

Absolutely, this is why a point system works better and everyone that is serious about running an organization/club should be using it.

Ross

I wish we had this much dialog at the meetings!!!! 

Ok,now I have a headache I agree with the points. 10 to win,9 for 2nd and so on. Show up points are ok with me and BB breaks ties. Matthew,we should take offense to your always putting Ben in first

Rob